Dutch Poetry

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Jonathan
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Dutch Poetry

Post by Jonathan » Fri Apr 17, 2015 3:44 am

Does anyone here read Dutch poetry? Who are the Dutch equivalents of Wordsworth, Shelley and Keats in Dutch Romanticism? Or any other era or movement, of the standard canon?

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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by ngonyama » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:41 am

I must admit I seldom do, but just before I logged in here I happened to have stumbled upon some Rhijnvis Feith. Late 18th century, not one of the 'best' periods or poets, but wonderfully sentimental. I had never read any but found it pretty amusing. The language he writes is pretty modern given when it was written.

Haar koontjes waren elk een roos
Haar lipjes twee morellen,
en onder 't luchtig bovenkleed
scheen blank albast te zwellen.

...


Hier zag de teedere ASPASIA
Haar' jongsten dag voor oogen
Haar Minnaar was naar 't heilig land
Met helm en speer getogen.

En viermaal was de lente alrêê
den leewrik komen wekken
Sints hij zij moedig ros beklom
En zij hem heên zag trekken

...

https://books.google.com/books?id=nYVOA ... ze&f=false

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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by Jonathan » Fri Apr 17, 2015 6:20 am

Well, that's something! I agree, it is amusing! Great kitsch appeal. :D

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BrutallyFrank
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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by BrutallyFrank » Fri Apr 17, 2015 9:19 am

"Moenie worrie nie, alles sal reg kom" (maar hy het nie gesê wanneer nie!)

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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by ngonyama » Fri Apr 17, 2015 4:11 pm

Jonathan wrote:Well, that's something! I agree, it is amusing! Great kitsch appeal. :D
Yes, I agree. It certainly has that effect on us, but consider the context. This was the late 18th century when a tiny elite of regents had all the money and nothing much else to do that getting lost in their own sentimentality. Soon the soap bubble they had grown up into was to burst leaving them to fall upon their naked behinds on the pointed cobblestones. Their contemporaries in France would fare worse: off with heads it was.

Holland was a libertarian society in those days. The rich blocked any decision that might have threatened their precious bubble.

Does it still sound like kitsch to you now? Or does it resonate loudly in places like the Congress of the US? I don;t know about Australia, but wasn't Murdoch one of you?

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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by Teodor » Mon Apr 20, 2015 10:20 pm

Jonathan wrote:Does anyone here read Dutch poetry? Who are the Dutch equivalents of Wordsworth, Shelley and Keats in Dutch Romanticism? Or any other era or movement, of the standard canon?
Like ngonyama, I must admit I rarely if ever read poetry. I think I can only claim to know two poems by heart:

(1) the shortest poem in the Dutch language, ascribed to the great Joost van den Vondel (1587-1679):
U
Nu!
When I say, I great, I mean that (in a sence) he's to the Dutch language what Shakespeare is to the English: the symbolical founder of 'modern' Dutch literature. The French often call English 'la langue de Shakespeare'; likewise, they call Dutch 'la langue de Vondel'. The difference being that Shakespeare is, in reality, much more read than Vondel is today. The reasons are, I think, twofold. First of all, the speakers of Dutch, unlike – well: unlike almost all other speakers of European languages – have very little interest in long dead authors who are, by virtue of being dead, not that able to play a major role in the commercial circus literature has become. Secondly, he simply lacks the existential depth Shakespeare has – who is, likewise, in my humble opinion dwarfed by Dostoyevsky (although it is said that the latter is stylistically sloppy). Be it as it may be, Vondel is part of the Dutch canon, especially his play Gijsbrecht van Aemstel

(2) Willem Elsschot's poem Het huwelijk. The “Tussen droom en daad” part is especially popular. Elsschot, however, is mainly known for his short novels, rather than for his poetry.

Neither belong to the era of Romanticism. The problem is that the significance of Romanticism in (Northern) Dutch cultural development is fairly unimpressive and its products usually considered not that impressive. Some of the most well-known names are probably Willem Bilderdijk, Piet Paaltjens and Jacob van Lennep (mostly known for his prose). I guess Hendrik Tollens, judging from his reputation (I've never even read him – shame on me), should fit this category as well – during his days, he was known as the greatest Dutch poet, but was later extremely ridiculed because of his bombastic style.
It played a much more prominent role in Flanders – notably the 'prose of Hendrik Conscience (often in his historical works reminiscent of similar 'national revival' type of works known from Central European literature, although I consider his 'contemporary' works such as De Loteling and Baes Gansendonck much more appealing). I think the greatest poet, close to romanticism is probably Guido Gezelle – the problem being that his language is deliberately archaic and dialectical, making it often difficult even for contemporary native speakers to understand (the link I provided is probably one of his most understandable poems, and perhaps because of that, one of his most popular). He considered his West Flemish dialect to be the purest and thereby the closest to the 'national spirit'; he also was wary of 'Hollands', which he – a reactionary catholic priest – saw as a potential instrument for the spread of 'perfidious' protestantism.

Leaving aside romanticism, I think the following would probably part of the Dutch language's poetical canon:
certain medieval texts, notably the Egidiuslied, Karel ende Elegast
from the Golden Age: Vondel, Hooft, Bredero, Constantijn Huyghens, Jacob 'vader' Cats
Hieronymus van Alphen (children's poetry, such as “Jantje zag eens pruimen hangen”)
Romanticism: Bilderdijk, Gezelle
the Tachtigers (as in: the 1880's): Herman Gorter (Een nieuwe lente en een nieuw geluid), Willem Kloos (“Ik ben een God in 't diepst van mijn gedachten)
20th century: J. C. Bloem, Vasalis, Hendrik Marsman (vitalism), Leo Vroman (“Liever heimwee dan Holland”)
the Vijftigers (1950's), such as Lucebert (“Alles van waarde is weerloos”), Hugo Claus (“Oostakkerse gedichten”), Simon Vinkenoog, Remco Campert

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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by BrutallyFrank » Tue Apr 21, 2015 8:28 am

And believe it or not, this is also a famous poem:

OOTE

Oote oote oote
Boe
Oote oote
Oote oote oote boe
Oe oe
Oe oe oote oote oote
A
A a a
Oote a a a
Oote oe oe
Oe oe oe
Oe oe oe oe oe
Oe oe oe oe oe
Oe oe oe oe oe oe oe
Oe oe oe etc.
Oote oote oote
Eh eh euh
Euh euh etc.
Oote oote oote boe
etc.
etc. etc.
Hoe boe hoe boe
Hoe boe hoe boe
B boe
Boe oe oe
Oe oe (etc.)
Oe oe oe oe
etc.
Eh eh euh euh euh
Oo-eh oo-eh o-eh eh eh eh
Ah ach ah ach ach ah a a
Oh ohh ohh hh hhh (etc.)
Hhd d d
Hdd
D d d d da
D dda d dda da
D da d da d da d da d da da
da
Da da demband
Demband demband dembrand dembrandt
Dembrandt Dembrandt Dembrandt
Doe d doe d doe dda doe
Da do do do da do do do
Do do da do deu d
Do do do deu deu doe deu deu
Deu deu deu da dd deu
Deu deu deu deu

Kneu kneu kneu kneu ote kneu eur
Kneu kneu ote kneu eur
Kneu ote ote ote ote ote
Ote ote oote
Ote ote
Boe
Oote oote oote boe
Oote oote boe oote oote oote boe
"Moenie worrie nie, alles sal reg kom" (maar hy het nie gesê wanneer nie!)

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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by Teodor » Tue Apr 21, 2015 5:28 pm

Hehe, I wonder if it has been translated into English yet ;)

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Re: Dutch Poetry

Post by knuffelbeertje » Wed May 06, 2015 12:33 am

I know that a lot of Dutch Tumblr users write poetry, if you're interested in that. Usually you just have to search for "Nederlands" and you find tons of it.

Ik weet dat veel Nederlanders die op Tumblr zitten hun eigen poëzie schrijven. Meestal hoef je alleen maar op "Nederlands" te zoeken en dan vind je heel veel ervan.
Please correct all my Dutch language mistakes. Every correction is appreciated! [-o< :D

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